CROdator

Interesting conversation and topic.
 
Some of you know that I am a player with pings in the 300+ range and that I don't sit still for long lol.
I know camping is allowed but I too do find that it is frustrating when you do get some that are able to camp in the same spot for the entire game and not be killed.
I have tried so many times to get to some of these campers without success and a large amount of death (I don't care about my KD)

It also frustrating when there are only certain ways to approach these players and you continues to get killed no matter what you do or how hard you try.
During some of these times, I just completely gave up and left, feeling that it destroyed my sense of fun playing.

IF only I was able to jump or fly above them to kill them lol (it would be a shock to the core)
Hmmm thinking along that line, maybe it could be earned when you get so many kills (instead of getting uav for VIP, we get to fly haha)
 
Okay, it not a good sight to see the admins here arguing about something that is affecting some of your regular players.
Honestly, I think the really hard core campers that has large amount of kills and no death should be warned to move to another camp spot if they still want to camp.
That way they are not camping in the one spot the whole map, move between camp spots instead.

Verbal warnings (ask them to move nicely  ) in game to begin with, if no action after asking 2-3 times(when you ask the 3rd time let them know that the next time will be a kick)(this gives them a chance to move) then I think the kick would work better than an admin warning.
 
I suggest all the admins needs to discuss this in private and come up with a solution that is fair on the campers and non campers. (Hence my suggestion above)
Cheers
 
Ohh and this is a really lovely, friendly family clan

Croda said it all  
 
I also agree with RedRose, hard camp is breaking the pleasure of a lot of players and that since COD exists. 
 
I understand KMB's point of view, his desire and involvement to make the server better (and sometimes more playable), but be careful about how you are doing it  
 
For exemple, do not warn and/or kick an other moderator , it's a friend and we must band together  
If you have a doubt contact a super admin or another member.
  Yes it's a good idea, recoil does not really exists on it and we can easily spray and one shot despite of the anticamp 
 
 
@610 *.* I hope you'll accept to stay with us and to know KMB better, he is not a bad guy
 

I can just say, have some more patience for the fix.
Sadly we don't have enough skilled people to do anything fast.

As for the discipline measures. It's all in a very gray area of the rules,
so i don't think it should be argued about because it will make no point.
Gray area meaning: this is borderline against the "Don't make your own rules" moderator abuse,
and then again It is kinda violating the anti-camp.

Nobody is at fault here, we just need time to make a valid compromise.
And yes my apparent dad @Behemoth here is right, we try to be as much as a family as we can.
 
After watching some vids i think that we should even somehow add more recoil to m21 hah.
There's a video of a guy shooting the P90 with one hand on full auto with steady recoil... says it all.

Hi 610,

Since I was the one who started all this because I believe I was the one who first kicked someone for chronic camping, I feel obligated to share my opinion about campers on this server.

I totally understand that when you're sniping, you don't want to run around in the middle of the map to get yourself killed. On the other hand, many players (active players will know very well who I'm talking about) take that to such extremes that they hide with M21 behind an obstacle so that only a few pixels of their head is visible, if at all. I think it was MVR who I kicked for chronic camping on crossfire where he always sits at spots that are hard to reach and he's almost invisible at these spots (note that he's also the guy who loves to abuse the sandbags glitch on ambush). With MVR, on crossfire he's notoriously camping in top hotel, on crash it's spawn-house balcony, on strike it's hotel square, on citystreets it's grave-yard and so on - always "head-glitching" (yes, that's a term used in CoD4). And one could argue that it's also part of the skill to blend in with the environment, and they would be right, partially it is, but again, not when you're sitting at one spot throughout the entire map and abusing these places that are hard to reach. It's so frustrating for other players that they are leaving the game. When I first kicked MVR for camping, it wasn't only on my behalf, I think he was even in my team, but many players left just because of him.

Camping has been an issue for a long time here and it's been such a big issue that @leiizko has spent I believe more than several evenings trying to implement something that would address the issue. Unfortunately, the implementation doesn't work as intended (which was broadly discussed in another thread), so I think we'll have to try something different. But since all of this takes a lot of time, I thought I would just help the situation by temporarily kicking these hard-campers (after asking them to move) from the game when they are causing other people to leave, until a working solution gets implemented. I'm trying to be as tolerant as I can be in this respect because as I already said, I really do understand that not everyone is keen about running with sniper rifle in the middle of the street.

CoD4 in general is not doing as great as last year and it's getting considerably worse every year. And I know for a fact that many former CoD4 players wanted to return to the game, only to find out that one of the most, if not the most occupied servers is full of campers that render the game unplayable. So yes, I'm trying to take actions to prevent this from happening.

I haven't been there when KMB warned you for camping, but I'm pretty sure he knew what he was doing.

Hope you'll think it through and stay with us


Best Regards

ProXicT.

i am not good at long paragraphs m8 but i'll keep it short and simple what ever your facing about camping or any problems remember that iceops is more like a family and if your not considered one at the first place they havnt accepted you in the beginning man i am here as your brother we all here!!!
i also made a son here not even brothers @CROdator my lovely son    
IceOps is all about having fun and enjoy your time and i am certain that you shall change your mind for your brother here asking not to leave just feel free to tell me every thing i will always be here you  can ask other fella members just tell me all your passing threw 
Plus your our bounty hunter man the most guy who keeps the server clean imagine those hackers without you in the server they will be annoying more than campers trust me 
Hope you take my words into consideration my friend 

Banned

In a server (don't remember the name right now) if you camp over like 30 seconds (just a number), the counter goes +1, a warn comes out and if you shoot at an enemy, it's like shooting at yourself (the enemy survives and you die).
As soon as you move, the penality goes off.
At the end of the game a writing appears with " Camper of the game: your_name" for the player who has camped several times.
 

Well it is one of the few games that are still massively popular after a decade.
It can be fun but also it can get boring if there aren't enough people to play with.

From my point of view based on my experience in playing cod since release.. most of us..got his own time to camp..so adding this dmg effects to reduce camping is very good ..but kmb i think if we have done anything more than this..it will make us loose our reputations..from one of the best servers..to a very annoying server..and this will increase if they kept camping after all..from my point of view its so good now..even there's alot of people dont come anymore due to the dmg effects that have been added..but not a big deal we still got our fans =]

TDM mod is really crowded so "blood effect" is not a good fit! however, "the increase in the time needed to heal back" seems fun! this way you might not get the kill but you get more assists.
Also because its hardcore "slow when hit" is useless! Like 99% of the time if you are hit you are dead already. 

I don't understand if this is on purpose, but noticed that this:
is a lie xd
timer doesn't reset to 10 seconds.
 
Lets say you camp for 10 seconds and move 8 seconds and stop, you will have only 2 seconds until the damage says 67% again.
Then you have to walk for ar least 3 seconds to get 100% for just 1 second until it gets back to 64%.

In short you have to run almost as many seconds as you were camping for it to return to 100% and to be able to stay in place for 10 seconds,
if you move less than that you will have less time with full damage.

I mean it's effective, everyone needs to move at all times, hah

All these gameplay updates aside, is there anyway we can get a new map rotation? These maps are getting quite old and a lot of players are asking for new maps, as admins we can change the maps ourselves but the players cant without having half the players voting yes and when it's full of 36 people, it's very difficult to actually get the map to change.

There is quite a few maps where it is literally impossible to get out of the spawn trap , e.g. Vacant, chinatown ,crash  i actually switch to spectator during these maps(most of the time) due to not being able to get out. I'm not an inexperienced player either and even for me its extremely difficult when the spawns are being hard locked by campers and grenades. Or maybe a function that is able to be put in that gives the team that cannot move from spawn a chance to actually get out.
 

that reminded me, I've heard that mostly people with ping lower than 60 have issues with hitreg, same when trying to hit someone that has ping low enough.
Which I find weird but it seems true.

Anticamp update attempt 2
 
Ditching the complex math behind it and keeping it simple this time.
 
Player health is now 30 again, wallbang damage does 67% damage. 
Anti camp has 3 levels: 100%, 67% and 34%. Semi auto sniper rifles start at 67% damage. On average everytime you go down a level, you will need 1 more shot to kill a player.
To drop a level you must be camping for 10 seconds per level. (10 seconds camp - 67%, 20 second camp - 34%). This timer will recharge 1.6s per every 1 real second you keep moving (you move a bit more than 6 seconds and you can camp for 10 seconds). The timer is invisible, you can only see your current damage.
 
What counts as not camping: As long as you walk in a straight line you will not trigger the anti camp. Rapidly moving left and right or moving while ADSing will count as camping due to greatly reduced speed, however you can normaly crouch walk or even moving while prone will not trigger the anti camp. In a nutshell - if you are not ADSing and holding the W key down, it will not count as camping.
 
Also curious if hitreg got a bit better.
 
 

I would say the wallbang damage should be set back to what it was prior to this update. The walls being penetrable wasn't the root cause of the problem anyway. The problem is campers who just hold one spot that is hard to reach from the opposing team. Yes, on crash this very spot is also easily penetrable through a wall, but that's just in this particular case.

And after many other gameplays, I think it's safe to say that the anti-camp feature should really be applied to sniper class, too, regardless of the weapon of choice. Since this update, so many players started using various sniper rifles, mainly M21, SVD and Barret. So half of the server consists of snipers now.

Also, increasing the players' health resulted in people asking if this is still an HC server. Deagle isn't one shot one kill anymore, even with higher impact. And even though the health got increased, some weapons, such as M21, are still OP. So I would go the other way around, that is decreasing the damage of the problematic weapons.

Nevertheless, it feels like we're getting into an XY problem here. And I think we should really focus on solving X, rather than trying to figure out ways to solve Y which is actually a problem caused by X.
In other words, the problem was that on this server there are too many notorious campers. This problem is now being mitigated by lowering weapon damage in case the player doesn't move for a certain period of time. And although it could still use some polishing, I think it's this that we should focus on. After this issue is addressed, we can think about the other problems we've talked about, such as the problem with grenade and RPG spamming.

My thoughts and ideas.
 
Love the anti camp idea, but some things should be changed. Firstly I feel the time it takes to get back up to full damage is too slow, maybe increase it 25%ish? 
 
Secondly the the time it takes after starting to move for the damage to start increasing needs to be change as well, but also how much you need to move or how far you need to move needs to be increased too. This way you can't simply just ad back and forth behind cover without losing damage essentially its  still camping, just slightly moving back and forth though. Hope that makes sense.
 
Snipers. Bolts and barret need to always be 1 shot kill to stomach chest and head, But should be 2 shot kill from wallbangs. Other semis need to be 2-3 shot kill and 3 shot + to wallbangs. The timings for for far you have to move and how fast damage increases and decreases needs to be tweaked too. Bolts and barret should be allowed to stand still longer to take shots and semis need to be less so. Watching angles with a bolt compared to a semi has its drawbacks because of rate of fire. Its a risk / reward thing. 
 
Deagle is not 1 shot kill (when posting this message) at 100% damage and should be. 2-3 shots for wallbangs. Keep damage multiplyers the same just tweak the damage to meet this. If possible.
 
Assult riles (all fully automatic) should be at least a 2 shot kill minimum. 3-4 maybe at super long range etc. G3 and G21 can be 1 shot, or maybe just 1 head shot 2 body as well. Numbers can be changed and played with. They should lose damage while standing still a bit slower then semi auto snipers and smgs. They are mid to long range weapons. 
 
SMGs should get a tiny damage boost, ak-74u takes soo many shots at range sometimes they feel a bit worthless, up close its fine. Same for uzi, p90, and mp5. Time it takes them to loose damage standing still should be the fastest and time to regain the slowest of the gun classes. They are run and gun guns, move with them. 
 
 
 
Don't really care about shotguns or other pistols do with them what you want.
 
EDIT: So it seems that when crouch walking, damage will not go up, it continues to go down even while moving. Normal walking it just slightly increases. This is not good. Crouch walking should increase damage and normal walking damage increase is just simply to slow. Aim crouch walking is even worse, and normal aim walking is just worse then normal walking. Aim walking and normal walking/ crouching should both increase at the same rate imo. I also experienced some bad hit reg today while testing this but didn't record it sadly. Whole deagle mag, and half an ak mag into someone and it did NOTHING. Guy turns around and insta kills me. Will be playing with Lagometer on for now on and watching out for these as this is infuriating when it happens and hopefully can be fixed or lessened. 
 
Also Nade spam, please for the love of god do something, anything about this, either remove them and only allow stuns and flashes, or have them on a universal timer after the first is thrown, maybe every 1-2 mins you get one? But something needs to be done. Maybe even drop the damage so that they cant 1 hit kill you unless you are already damaged. Take Csgos grenades for example. 
 
Also also, just remove Rpg. Seriously who uses that as a main weapon? Why? Why!??
 
Edit again: After playing a couple matches, it seems like this has not really effected campers at all. At least from what I can tell. Everyone still posts up in their spots and sits there the entire game. Sure the damage reduction has helped somewhat (very marginally), but with such low health anyways, and me always worrying about how much damage I am able to do now constantly watching that meter, always trying to keep moving, I cant aim walk around corners anymore without fearing I wont do any damage to an enemy I cant even fucking see before getting shot at. Semi snipers REALLY need a fucking nerf excuse my language but it is still INFURIATING dying to them while they STILL sit in the same fucking spots hiding away at the back of the map watching the most bullshit angles and I can't fucking do shit about it because I either die before getting close enough, or die to them. Sure, get good, I know, I'm not a bad player by any means so I wont take that as any constructive criticism. This has nothing to do with me or the way I play. 
 
One more thing, please remove the annoying ass reload cancel fix please it has gotten me killed so many times.
Link to video testing walking and damage increase - 
 

OH BTW at the end of every round there is the sound "AH" every like 4 seconds which is really annoying. It continues until the map changes
demo.dm_1
check it out if you don't believe xD
NOW I'm sure it's not just the end of the round! it's constantly happening. like every 5seconds... it's really annoying 

The most 'Abused' sniper would be the M21, i use an r700 and m40a3 whilst running around, now if they were to NOT one shot then that would deem the r700 and m40 useless as they already are single shot rifles and take time to shoot again and not semi automatics as you can shoot the m21 soo much quicker, unless this is only being applied to the semi automatic sniper.

I love the update tho , smart idea and brilliant execution


 

Update:
Wallbang damage has been increased from 25% to 40%. If this still feels too weak it will be further increased.
Player health has been increased to 50 for real this time. There was a bug that caused health to revert back to 30. Also clarification on this change: the purpose is not to stop one shot kills but to aid in general gameplay balance. Most of the weapons have so much damage, the damage reduction wouldn't help unless it went into absurdly low levels.
 
As for the snipers it is a bit trickier. Every sniper rifle does 70 damage per shot meaning the damage would need to be reduced by 30% to stop one shot kills. If anti camp worked on snipers as well in current state, a bit of dancing around would be all it takes to keep the modifier value above 70%.

Well, it's an HC server, so weapons with higher calibre should be one shot one kill in case of torso/head-shot

-Maybe we could set the snipers to have same thing but with longer delay, so they can stay put but not for too long.
Or as @Milad noted, some snipers are not so problematic.. so lower their dmg a bit or include semi-auto snipers to the anti camp.

-Also we could increase wallbang damage to 50%, some weapons barely do anything through walls now.
Some walls are easily penetrated, like in the killhouse map, there is no helping that map, hah.

And I noticed that the percentage of damage sometimes starts at the value which was active when you died, don't know if it' is a visual or something else.

-Definitely agree with the others regarding the wall bang damage being too low.  
-I have also noticed (same as CRO) that the anti camp damage percentage doesn't reset back to 100 after death and re-spawn. It stays at the percentage you had before death. Was this intentional or a bug?
-If the intention of increasing player hp was to stop weapons insta killing, then i'm not sure how well this has been implemented. I almost exclusively play with the G3, in my opinion the most OP weapon in the game, as long as you're accurate. However this still insta kills to upper body and head, so it just gives me the advantage of increased health further making the class OP. Not saying i want to gun nerfed because its the only weapon i use, but just wanted it to be noted.
 

I agree and support @Milad.
But to be honest, not every player playing the role of a sniper is able to storm an enemy respawn. Snipers should essentially sit back in the distance, but I think need to reduce damage after ~45 (or more) seconds not moving. This gives a slight advantage over other classes, but is also prone to nerf.

-Maybe we could set the snipers to have same thing but with longer delay, so they can stay put but not for too long.
Or as @Milad noted, some snipers are not so problematic.. so lower their dmg a bit or include semi-auto snipers to the anti camp.

-Also we could increase wallbang damage to 50%, some weapons barely do anything through walls now.
Some walls are easily penetrated, like in the killhouse map, there is no helping that map, hah.

And I noticed that the percentage of damage sometimes starts at the value which was active when you died, don't know if it' is a visual or something else.

-Maybe we could set the snipers to have same thing but with longer delay, so they can stay put but not for too long.
Or as @Milad noted, some snipers are not so problematic.. so lower their dmg a bit or include semi-auto snipers to the anti camp.

-Also we could increase wallbang damage to 50%, some weapons barely do anything through walls now.
Some walls are easily penetrated, like in the killhouse map, there is no helping that map, hah.

And I noticed that the percentage of damage sometimes starts at the value which was active when you died, don't know if it' is a visual or something else.